And let's remember, the GOP doesn't really want to "fix" social security. The party's donors see all that money just. sitting. there. and desperately need a way to get their hands on it.
i would like to write a long comment to Waldman himself if he reads this. he makes a good start but also makes a few dangerous errors because he is working off "what everyone knows" and could use a few additional facts.
How about not raising taxes at all and just change the law from a pay-as-you-go program to one that allows federal revenue to supplement the program just like Medicare part B. It just requires a change in the law, no additional taxes.
Most conservatives are too rich to even qualify for Social Security, which is why their self interest points to cutting or eliminating it, especially when progressives want to expand it.
my reply was overwritten on the first comment . briefly it says you appear to not know how SS works.
the rich qualify for benefits according to what they paid in. because SS is insurance and not welfare, what the rich pay in is limited to wht the value of SS is to them. including the possibility that they might not sill be rich by the time they retire or can no longer work. if they do not become poor, their contribution helps pay the benefits of those who do.
There is a cap on what people pay into SS. I known damn well how it works. I'm on SS, duh.
The rich pay only on the first couple of hundred thousand of their income regardless of how many millions they bring in as annual income. On the other hand, the average American pays much more.
The monies paid by Americans who are still working are now paying for those of us who are collecting in retirement. Wealthy Americans are not paying the lion's share. This was never meant to be the case except that the Republicans robbed money from Social Security and never put it back.
You must be very out of touch not to know how many members of Congress are millionaires. And you think I'm out of touch LOL
SS is not welfare, it is a way for working people to save their own money...safe from inflation and market downturns and some personal bad luck and even lack of prudence. The rich pay into it up to a cap that is fair to them in terms of what they get out of it. some real interest and insurance in case they stop being rich when they can no longer work.
the young are not paying for us, they are paying in advance for their own needs when they cannot work. we paid for our retirements while we still had jobs.
the rich pay into SS more than you do/did. and they get less out of it as a percent of what they paid in. the "extra" they pay in is what pays the "insurance" for those too poor their whole lives to have paid enough in to SS, even with the interest they get, for a meaningful retirement (i.e. not in desperate poverty). No one has robbed money from Social Security. The government borrowed the extra money SS was saving for the boomer retirement. That money is now being paid back as intended. I do know that many members of Congress are millionaires, and I know that many of them are liars. not space enough here for me to tell you all you do not know. It's not your fault. You don't know how to find out for yourself, and everything you think you know started out as a lie by either those who want to destroy SS, or now, sadly, those who want to turn it into welfare..which roosevelt warned us against. I have been writing about SS for over fifteen years on AngryBear blog. you won't like how i write, but you might learn something. if you find the blog, find the index and look for Social Security.
“the rich pay into SS more than you do/did.” The cap means that the rich pay a lower rate, though. And they already benefit from myriad other tax breaks.
the rich pay the same rate you do up to the cap. the cap is there so that they do not pay more than SS is worth to them. If we made them pay more than it is worth to them they would destroy Social Security. They have the power to do that. FDR designed SS to be worker paid "so no damn politician can take it away from them." Your idea about "fair" would mean that a millionaire would have to pay 20 dollars for a loaf of bread that you pay two dollars for "because he has more money than I have."
Most people, when they are thinking about it, would not think this was "fair." Neither is it smart.
The rich do pay more in dollars into Social Security than you do. That more is what enables SS to pay more to the very poor than they have paid for. This is designed as insurance, not welfare. the rich get back LESS as a percent of what they paid in than you do. Again, this is because Social Security is designed to be insurance as well as a very very safe way to save your own money and get interest enough to pay for your own groceries when you can no longer work. Some rich people resent this...they think they are paying for your groceries. They are wrong...they are paying insurance in case something happens to them and they are no longer rich when they can no longer work. The system is very well designed, but the people who hate it...and the people who blindly hate "the rich", have told so many lies about it for so long that it is very hard for people who have not studied it--honestly--to understand how it works.
If you make $100,000/yr, your payroll tax for Social Security is 6.2%. If I make $200,000/yr, my effective payroll tax is 5.2%; $500,000, 2%. That’s the way people look at it, and I don’t blame them. BTW, because life expectancy goes up with income, my lifetime payout is going to be dramatically more regardless of monthly payout.
I don’t live in fear of the Uber wealthy plutocrats. Their ongoing attempts SS and Medicare always flop.
SS is not welfare, it is a way for working people to save their own money...safe from inflation and market downturns and some personal bad luck and even lack of prudence. The rich pay into it up to a cap that is fair to them in terms of what they get out of it. some real interest and insurance in case they stop being rich when they can no longer work.
the young are not paying for us, they are paying in advance for their own needs when they cannot work. we paid for our retirements while we still had jobs.
the rich pay into SS more than you do/did. and they get less out of it as a percent of what they paid in. the "extra" they pay in is what pays the "insurance" for those too poor their whole lives to have paid enough in to SS, even with the interest they get, for a meaningful retirement (i.e. not in desperate poverty). No one has robbed money from Social Security. The government borrowed the extra money SS was saving for the boomer retirement. That money is now being paid back as intended. I do know that many members of Congress are millionaires, and I know that many of them are liars. not space enough here for me to tell you all you do not know. It's not your fault. You don't know how to find out for yourself, and everything you think you know started out as a lie by either those who want to destroy SS, or now, sadly, those who want to turn it into welfare..which roosevelt warned us against. I have been writing about SS for over fifteen years on AngryBear blog. you won't like how i write, but you might learn something. if you find the blog, find the index and look for Social Security.
actually i was treating you as a person who did not know much because she had been lied to by a very well financed organaization of people who hate Social Security. But it appears now that your problem is deeper. You don't seem to know what "pedantic"means, except that it is an insult that you can throw at people who you think think they know more than you. But it also conveys the meaning that you think that what they know is trivial. Social Security is not trivial, and your lack of knowledge and that of 200 million other people is dangerous to you and them.
As for egotist...just another insult you can throw at people who know more than you do. You must get to use it a lot. I am far from an egotist. On most things I recognize my limited knowledge. But I have spent a lot of time studying how Social Scurity works, and I do understand it, and understand what you do not. Heaven forbid that I should try to teach you something before you hurt yourself.
And let's remember, the GOP doesn't really want to "fix" social security. The party's donors see all that money just. sitting. there. and desperately need a way to get their hands on it.
my comment to Marycat below appears to have overwritten this comment. sorry. please repost if you can.
i would like to write a long comment to Waldman himself if he reads this. he makes a good start but also makes a few dangerous errors because he is working off "what everyone knows" and could use a few additional facts.
How about not raising taxes at all and just change the law from a pay-as-you-go program to one that allows federal revenue to supplement the program just like Medicare part B. It just requires a change in the law, no additional taxes.
kind of like fixing your car by throwing a wrench at it.
Most conservatives are too rich to even qualify for Social Security, which is why their self interest points to cutting or eliminating it, especially when progressives want to expand it.
my reply was overwritten on the first comment . briefly it says you appear to not know how SS works.
the rich qualify for benefits according to what they paid in. because SS is insurance and not welfare, what the rich pay in is limited to wht the value of SS is to them. including the possibility that they might not sill be rich by the time they retire or can no longer work. if they do not become poor, their contribution helps pay the benefits of those who do.
There is a cap on what people pay into SS. I known damn well how it works. I'm on SS, duh.
The rich pay only on the first couple of hundred thousand of their income regardless of how many millions they bring in as annual income. On the other hand, the average American pays much more.
The monies paid by Americans who are still working are now paying for those of us who are collecting in retirement. Wealthy Americans are not paying the lion's share. This was never meant to be the case except that the Republicans robbed money from Social Security and never put it back.
You must be very out of touch not to know how many members of Congress are millionaires. And you think I'm out of touch LOL
saying you know doesn't make it so.
SS is not welfare, it is a way for working people to save their own money...safe from inflation and market downturns and some personal bad luck and even lack of prudence. The rich pay into it up to a cap that is fair to them in terms of what they get out of it. some real interest and insurance in case they stop being rich when they can no longer work.
the young are not paying for us, they are paying in advance for their own needs when they cannot work. we paid for our retirements while we still had jobs.
the rich pay into SS more than you do/did. and they get less out of it as a percent of what they paid in. the "extra" they pay in is what pays the "insurance" for those too poor their whole lives to have paid enough in to SS, even with the interest they get, for a meaningful retirement (i.e. not in desperate poverty). No one has robbed money from Social Security. The government borrowed the extra money SS was saving for the boomer retirement. That money is now being paid back as intended. I do know that many members of Congress are millionaires, and I know that many of them are liars. not space enough here for me to tell you all you do not know. It's not your fault. You don't know how to find out for yourself, and everything you think you know started out as a lie by either those who want to destroy SS, or now, sadly, those who want to turn it into welfare..which roosevelt warned us against. I have been writing about SS for over fifteen years on AngryBear blog. you won't like how i write, but you might learn something. if you find the blog, find the index and look for Social Security.
“the rich pay into SS more than you do/did.” The cap means that the rich pay a lower rate, though. And they already benefit from myriad other tax breaks.
Paul
the rich pay the same rate you do up to the cap. the cap is there so that they do not pay more than SS is worth to them. If we made them pay more than it is worth to them they would destroy Social Security. They have the power to do that. FDR designed SS to be worker paid "so no damn politician can take it away from them." Your idea about "fair" would mean that a millionaire would have to pay 20 dollars for a loaf of bread that you pay two dollars for "because he has more money than I have."
Most people, when they are thinking about it, would not think this was "fair." Neither is it smart.
The rich do pay more in dollars into Social Security than you do. That more is what enables SS to pay more to the very poor than they have paid for. This is designed as insurance, not welfare. the rich get back LESS as a percent of what they paid in than you do. Again, this is because Social Security is designed to be insurance as well as a very very safe way to save your own money and get interest enough to pay for your own groceries when you can no longer work. Some rich people resent this...they think they are paying for your groceries. They are wrong...they are paying insurance in case something happens to them and they are no longer rich when they can no longer work. The system is very well designed, but the people who hate it...and the people who blindly hate "the rich", have told so many lies about it for so long that it is very hard for people who have not studied it--honestly--to understand how it works.
If you make $100,000/yr, your payroll tax for Social Security is 6.2%. If I make $200,000/yr, my effective payroll tax is 5.2%; $500,000, 2%. That’s the way people look at it, and I don’t blame them. BTW, because life expectancy goes up with income, my lifetime payout is going to be dramatically more regardless of monthly payout.
I don’t live in fear of the Uber wealthy plutocrats. Their ongoing attempts SS and Medicare always flop.
saying you know doesn't make it so.
SS is not welfare, it is a way for working people to save their own money...safe from inflation and market downturns and some personal bad luck and even lack of prudence. The rich pay into it up to a cap that is fair to them in terms of what they get out of it. some real interest and insurance in case they stop being rich when they can no longer work.
the young are not paying for us, they are paying in advance for their own needs when they cannot work. we paid for our retirements while we still had jobs.
the rich pay into SS more than you do/did. and they get less out of it as a percent of what they paid in. the "extra" they pay in is what pays the "insurance" for those too poor their whole lives to have paid enough in to SS, even with the interest they get, for a meaningful retirement (i.e. not in desperate poverty). No one has robbed money from Social Security. The government borrowed the extra money SS was saving for the boomer retirement. That money is now being paid back as intended. I do know that many members of Congress are millionaires, and I know that many of them are liars. not space enough here for me to tell you all you do not know. It's not your fault. You don't know how to find out for yourself, and everything you think you know started out as a lie by either those who want to destroy SS, or now, sadly, those who want to turn it into welfare..which roosevelt warned us against. I have been writing about SS for over fifteen years on AngryBear blog. you won't like how i write, but you might learn something. if you find the blog, find the index and look for Social Security.
Pedantic egotist much?
Marycat
actually i was treating you as a person who did not know much because she had been lied to by a very well financed organaization of people who hate Social Security. But it appears now that your problem is deeper. You don't seem to know what "pedantic"means, except that it is an insult that you can throw at people who you think think they know more than you. But it also conveys the meaning that you think that what they know is trivial. Social Security is not trivial, and your lack of knowledge and that of 200 million other people is dangerous to you and them.
As for egotist...just another insult you can throw at people who know more than you do. You must get to use it a lot. I am far from an egotist. On most things I recognize my limited knowledge. But I have spent a lot of time studying how Social Scurity works, and I do understand it, and understand what you do not. Heaven forbid that I should try to teach you something before you hurt yourself.